R45?

[harrydog]

Actually, I'm just kidding.
9mm is plenty for a pocket gun.

[R9SCarry]

haha!  I reckon we have all given this some thought!  Inevitable eh!  It could I'm sure be done but -- obviously, fatter,a bit heavier - and not quite so ''pocketable''.  

So yeah .. for me 9mm is it.  That works!

BTW .. Welcome.

[GeorgeH]

I'd like to say Bersa, but I just can't remember, but about 6 months ago, I saw a fairly small 45 ACP, that had a Rohrbaugh kind of look to it. You could put it in your pocket, but it wasn't a pocketgun.

As to pocketguns, the Rohrbaugh footprint is about as large as you can get and still fit my definition of a true pocketgun. (Ie. conceal it in a holster in a rear pocket of most slacks.)

People keep talking about Kahr coming out with a plastic 45 ACP. I hope it is true. I like the caliber and would love a 45 smaller or lighter than my Glock 36.

I like that new Smith snub nosed 45 revolver. It is so ugly, it is beautiful.

I've never found a ankle holster that I really liked. But guns like the Rohrbaugh, the Kahr PM9 and PM40, makes me want to reconsider.

[R9SCarry]

George .... I got a ''Pro-Tech'' ... ''Outdoors'' ankle rig and it holds my P3-AT nicely .. and so also does a good job with the R9 .... it's comfortable and so far about best i have found.

''Anklepocket'' also is a good rig but more bulky ... and a tad hot in warmer conditions.

If you wish I will take a pic of the former to let you see it.  Just ask.

[flyandscuba]

GeorgeH,

I've got a Bersa Thunder 45 pictured below.  It is small but way too big (and heavy) for pocket carry.  For $299 though, it is a great buy for a compact .45 ACP.  Quality is excellent and performance more than adequate for a short barreled big bore...

Years ago (back in the '80s), I did carry a Detonics 45 in an ankle holster...

[harrydog]

Well, if you really, really must carry a really, really small .45 pistol, you can always get yourself one of these babies.

http://hunting.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.downsizer.com

[R9SCarry]

Harry - pretty incredible piece I'll admit ..... would mean tho in extremis ... you'd sure being praying for a one-shot-stop!!

(''Hang on BG - I gotta reload''! )

[flyandscuba]

Want more than one shot?  There is always the Simmerling LM4



Quote:

"The legendary Simmerling is one of the smallest .45 ACP's ever made. This incredible vest pocket pistol has a 5-shot capacity, and the first round is carried in the chamber ready for instant use just like a revolver or a larger frame .45 Auto. The LM4 weighs in at just 24 oz., and is only 5.2 x 3.7 inches in size with a thickness of 1 inch. The LM4 will be produced in limited quantities."

I don't think these are in current production.  I first learned of them in the late '70s or early '80s.  Never saw one in person.  the kicker was -- you had to manually cycle the slide between shots.  The slide was locked.  Kind of a semi-automatically reloaded single shot derringer!

And to think -- we worry just about "sights or no sights"!!!

[GeorgeH]

Hi R9S:

Yes, I'd like to see a photo of the ankle holsters that you mention. I don't have the ability to post photos from home. Ron Graham is bugging me to send him photo's of my pink Sperry Rand boat shoes, which I will do one day.

[GeorgeH]

Hi Flyandscuba:

I like the Bersa. But it wasn't what I was thinking about. For a guy who loves pocketguns, I love the 45ACP cartridge.

[GeorgeH]

Hi Fly:

The Simmerling is available through the American Derringer Corportation as a special order firearm for a price that makes the Rohrbaugh appear downright cheap. If ADC would sell the gun for under a grand, I would buy it, if for no other reason than as a collectable, but the last time I checked, the price was so high as to cause my heart to flutter.

[flyandscuba]

Sounds to me like when/if the Rohrbaugh's get caught up, they should take the concept of the Simmerling and improve upon it...

Making a pocket-sized .45 (even if it only had a 4 + 1 capacity) for like you say -- under $1000, might be very marketable.

I'd buy one...

[GeorgeH]

Hopefully Rohrbaugh never gets caught up. I think it is the dream of every gunmaker to have a multi-year backlog like Seecamp.

My guess would be that Rohrbaugh, in the short run, will try to exploit their current platform. A 380 version for the overseas market, maybe a 22 trainer, maybe an all steel trainer. Bottom line--it makes sense to get as much millage out of the design as possible.

Then I think they would look at new products. For example, I have always wanted someone to compete directly with Seecamp. NAA has come close. But the Seecamp 380 has opened up a new avenue. Seecamp makes their pistol from an investment cast frame. But the 380 cartridge is taxing that design. Maybe, Rohrbaugh can complete by making their own CZ design  clone from a forged steel billet. It would allow Rohrbaugh to use their own established technology (machining from forged billets). Seecamp still would be lighter (by about an oz), but the forged version would last longer and have the same footprint. If Rohrbaugh wants to make a slightly larger version, by beefing up the slide, they could have an advantage by being able to have Gutter Snipe or traditional sights, which is a limitation on the Seecamp. Or offer a two slide version--one without sights like the Seecamp and one with sights (the trade off would be weight).

But the R9s, would still be lighter. However, there is a large market for small pocketguns, but a limited number of makers around.

Look at the 1911A1 design. Tons of companies make use the same design and make money from it. By refining a existing design Rohrbaugh can bring a second product to market with limited R&D and start-up expense.

The internal finishing of a Rohrbaugh is unquestionably superior to that of Seecamp. Seecamps are perfect from the outside, but with Rohrbaugh's attention to detail, they could deliver a superior product at a lower cost than Seecamp.

I love competition. The winner is always the consumer--me and you.

But the thought of a vest pocket 45 ACP, even if a single shot 4+1 design does perk up my interest.

[R9SCarry]

But the thought of a vest pocket 45 ACP, even if a single shot 4+1 design does perk up my interest.

I'll add my interest too ... if it could be done.

George ... only just noticed your mention re ankle rigs .. I'll get to taking a pic today if i can and then post.

[R9SCarry]

George - those ankle rigs ....... quick pics ... beat up ol' sandals .. some wierd ol' socks I found! ... and ol' legs still not very tanned.  But I tell ya - this is shorts weather right now - thus what you see


Here we go - first the Ankle Pocket ..... this is a very comfortable rig if a bit bulky.  It is also likely to make the leg a bit warm other than in winter .. well it does me.  So - this one is useful for when cooler ... and with good large pants .. Dockers etc.  It is actually is sized for my Bersa Thunder .. and could well be made smaller for the R9 ... and that would reduce bulk a bit.





Then we have the ProTech ''Outdoors'' . very nice rig .. better for warmer conditions.  This one is for P3-AT and so is ideal for R9.  I like this one a lot.  I do find that in use - I keep an ankle rig round slightly to front ...... this helps obviate the tendency for gun grips to project to inner side and rear, enough to show underneath pants.  The slight rotation helps the gun find the more natural space in front.  In fact I'd rotate even more than in this pic.



Hope these show enough to help. .. hmmm ... had to check links again ....