Non-Scientific Ammo Test

[Marine Ordnance]

MM,

It is my opinion that using ammo that shows signs of high pressure in a firearm not designed for high power loads may cause damage.  That is why I only fired five rounds after examining the fired cases.  



Bill

I'll get this picture thing figured out ....

[tracker]

Bill,
Would you please forward your info and opinions to Steve Hornady? They have been in business for over 100 years and deserve a chance to respond to the high pressure allegation; otherwise, it is only an opinion.
Thanks.

http://www.hornady.com/contact_us.php

[Marine Ordnance]

Tracker,

This whole thread has been a personal opinion and not an allegation that the company is producing less than quality ammunition.  I am in no way leveling critcism at Hornady.  I use their match ammo in two of my rifles.

The title of this thread is Non-Scientific Ammo Test.  I shot three different self defense loads and noticed an irregularity in one of the three brands of ammo.  My intent was to give the members of this forum a "Head's up!" and to be on the lookout for the same results that I experienced regardless of brand.

Bill

[sdlsaginaw]

Found the picture I posted awhile ago...

On left is HCD with flat primer, center is PMC with typical R9 dent, right is brass fired from who-knows-what showing a more typical deep dent.

[tracker]

On a non-scientific basis I just compared an unfired CD to several other .9mm rounds, including Winchester. It is my opinion that the CD primer has slightly less gap between it and the casing than other ammo. Also, it appears to be flatter and more flush than other ammo. In summary, it appears to be of a tighter manufacturing process.
The main problem I have with your opinion is that you draw a conclusion that this perceived difference is caused by an apparent higher pressure in the CD vis-a'-vis other rounds. The fact that the CD did not function well in your gun is irrefutable; I just don't agree with your fault analysis.

[Marine Ordnance]

Tracker,

In your opinion what do you think caused the primers to flatten during firing?  Have you run any Critical Defense 115gr FTX ammo through your Rohrbaugh R9?

Bill

[tracker]

I am saying that the primers in CD are flatter than other rounds before you fire them. I have fired numerous rounds of the CD in my R9, all successfully, and that is now my carry round. In my opinion, it is far superior to whatever is in second place and I have tried every premium brand of ammo recommended in this forum. They are all good, some just work better than others.

[yankee2500]

I have been pleased with the CD ammo and carry it in my R9 and in my P380, when I can find some in 40S&W it will be in my PM40 as well. It's possible that the primers are softer or thinner than the others and that could account for the flattening.
 It functions well in both of my pistols, and felt recoil seems no different than Gold Dots or Silvertips to me.
  The gun shop were I do most of my business sold a lady a 9mm pistol and some CD ammo, which she later used to shoot her better half twice in the back and once in the back of the head, the Sheriff told the guys at the shop that the damage done by these rounds was some of the worst he had seen.
John

[Marine Ordnance]

Tracker,

Unfired ammo tells you very little.  Deep seated primers can cause misfires and 'soft' primers may cause some problems.

Pictures recently posted by sdlsaginaw also show a flattened HCD primer.

Again I ask you - In your opinion what caused the HCT ammo to have flat primers and no firing pin 'dent' after being fired?

Bill

[tracker]

We are not speaking the same language; please contact the factory to discuss your problem.

[sdlsaginaw]

I'm very curious what the fired primers look like from one of the R9s on the list that they are reliable in.  

Do they have the same flat look or are they dented like other rounds?

[Marine Ordnance]

Hi All,

I received a response from Hornady this morning asking me to ship them the CD ammo I was having problems with (flat primers).

I will let you know what I find out.

Bill

[tracker]

Thanks, Bill.

[Cap.]

I've got some 115gr HCD. I'll shoot some this weekend and let you know what I find.

[Cap.]

I had a chance to fire some HCD 115 gr in both my R9 and a friends P7. The ammo used in both was from the same box.

The HCD primers are significantly flatter after firing in the R9. Also the area around the strike was kind of 'starred out'. It tore that metal up pretty good. Enough that I would worry that small particles of metal could (and probably do) fly away from the primer and potentially lodge themselves somewhere I don't want them to.

When fired in the P7, the primers looked 100% normal. Still rounded, clean pin strike indentation, no seperating metal.

There is clearly something different happening with this ammo in the R9. I'll take a picture and get it posted on here sometime soon.

I think that at this point, Hornady engineers need to be aware of this and tell us R9 owners what they think.