Author Topic: Second time with my new R9s - problems!  (Read 23502 times)

Offline tracker

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #45 on: May 29, 2006, 01:02:10 PM »
Dave,
Well said; it would be difficult to disagree with any
of your points because they all make sense. A lemon
is a lemon whether it be a firearm, car, camera, or
whatever it is mechanical that has chronic malfunctionitis.

Offline theirishguard

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #46 on: May 29, 2006, 03:17:53 PM »
Dave, well said, I too would not buy a refurb of any kind. It doesn't seem worth the few dollar savings. In this case it sure was not worth all the trouble.
Tom
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Offline Richard S

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #47 on: May 29, 2006, 05:38:53 PM »
Quote
Mines improved considerably but still not were it should be. Ill keep trying but I gotta tell ya, Ive heard MANY negative reports both here and on other forums. If I had to do it over again knowing and seeing all this....I dont know. Refurb or not!

c.k:

Dave has said it about as eloquently as it can be stated.  He speaks for me on this subject.

As the proud owner of R9 No. 132 (the 32nd "Pup" to be sold to the public), I monitor the Forum on a regular basis.  Somehow, I seem to have missed all of those "MANY negative reports" on the R9 to which you refer.  R9 No. 132 has shown no vices.

I took delivery of my R9 in May 2004.  I had ordered it sight unseen based on a description of the prototype emanating from the 2002 Shot Show.  Here is a link to an account of my first range session with the Rohrbaugh -- also my first post to the Forum:

http://www.rohrbaughforum.com/YaBB.cgi?board=R9S;action=display;num=1085538678

Since that time, No. 132 has shown no vices, her only modifications being a new recoil spring and a new set of grip screws.  Of course, I continue my quest for a set of sterling silver grips for her -- something rather like these:


8)

« Last Edit: May 29, 2006, 05:46:52 PM by Richard_S »
(1963-1967) "GO ARMY!"

Offline capt.koolaid

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #48 on: May 29, 2006, 06:54:19 PM »
Gentlemen! Relax! I apologize if Ive offended anyone. My sole intention here is to get something out of my investment, Hopefully thru advice etc. I agree it gets old seeing in print negative reports of your favorite gun but you see, When faced with delema, its easy to focus on the negative. Im sure thier are many posts boasting of the superiority of the R-9, But If mine was great, Id be reading and posting along side them! I realize my frustration has been posted here initialy in rather kurt fashion, however Ive been updating for the purpose of folks like Guiness who share my expieriances in the hopes that we may find/work this out together since often, failures and problems posted here have no "follow-up" reports. I will stop. I dont want to present myself as a troll or something.

That being said, I agree I should probably fish or cut bait with this gun but Im schedualed to qualify with it Tommorow so it gets yet another chance to prove itself. In addition, Im curious to see what the "brothers" do for Guiness as its my understanding he shipped his back. Obviously if it is returned with the "kinks" worked out, Then I will follow suit. I on the other hand am reluctant to ship my R-9 off since Ive read HERE of some folks who followed suit and when the weapon was returned it was just as bad, if not worse than before. So, if I can atleast save from shipping it out.....I will.

As far as the refurb thing goes, Its real simple, according to Arego's it has the same warranty. According to Rohrbaugh, ( I checked before I bought) these were not "lemons" but guns purchased by a group of women who could not handle them ( This was what the lady at Rohrbaugh said, not me, Please, no insults of calling me a shovenist pig). So, I took her word and bought one. I ASSUMED since they were REFURBS that the company would have gone over them with a fine tooth comb and did some quality control, ( They took the time to replace the Carbon fiber grips with the new improved ugly ones).

Lastly, YES thier are lemons. In everything, like people! Im not sure if mine was made on a Monday or a Friday but I do know this: When handed lemons, make lemonade. This was the ONLY chance ive had to purchase a R-9 ANYWHERE. I advertised that money was not an object and STILL these guns have eluded me since I became aware of them and now that Ive finally found one, Fickle as it may be, Im not real keen on selling it or shipping it off JUST YET.  I have been rather disgusted though, As would anyone I assume, when a $20.00 Raven out performs this machine! That being said, My lovely wife has taken hold of my LWS .380  ;)so im stuck with either the R-9 or the Raven for pocket gun carry.

In conclusion, At worst, Ive got a 9mm pocket rocket that feels good in the hand, has a trigger pull second to none, and thiers something to be said for owning the worlds smallest, lightest 9mm pistol around. I enjoy showing it off to the gun club snobs, carrying it with my Sig, etc. but if I had to use it, well its a coin toss as to if it would work after the first round "jam free". But, Its only slightly bigger than a 9mm derringer so I guess thats o.k......Oh well, Im off to the range! Ill enjoy shooting my "pup" and who knows???? if Im using the right ammo, gripping the gun properly,using the right lube, firing a clean weapon, with a "good batch" of ammo, and the grip screws tight, and the winds out of the west, and the stars are in proper alignment with the moon, I may just make it thru the 37 round qualification course with narry a hiccup. If not, Im just a dumb cop, who will go back to relying on a $20.00 .25 auto saturday night special for a backup/off duty gun, with a really cool (al be it expensive) paperwieght. Good day. :-*

Offline harrydog

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #49 on: May 29, 2006, 06:59:52 PM »
Quote
I have friends who own Rock River 1911s, very good and expensive 1911s, in both .45acp and .38 super. Both guns ran bad until about 500 rounds and then shot great. My thoughts are this: a very expensive gun does not always mean it will always run well. Some guns need to be shot in.
Some guns do need to be "shot in" but I really don't think that should have to be the case.
My Springfield Professional was a VERY tightly fitted gun and was 100% reliable from the very first round fired. Same with my Wilson Tactical Elite. I also have a 1911 built by Paul Liebenberg which is very tightly fitted. He told me that it would require no break-in to be reliable and he was correct. Some "high end" 1911 builders seem to think it's okay to let the owner do the final fitting of the gun by shooting it as opposed to doing that painstaking fitting by hand prior to shipping out the gun.
The R9 is a different situation though, being that it's pushing the size envelope on 9mm pistols. It's probably more inherently finicky than most other guns, and I don't mean that in a negative way. In other words, there is probably very, very little margin for error, both in how the parts interact as well as with how the shooter holds it.  I would expect that some improvement may come with break-in, but I really wouldn't think it would take more that 100 rounds or so.
I feel bad for those who just can't get the R9 to work for them. Those who have 100% reliable R9's - consider yourselves fortunate. There is no better carry piece of that size in my opinion.

Offline Richard S

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #50 on: May 29, 2006, 07:47:49 PM »
Quote
Gentlemen! Relax! I apologize if Ive offended anyone. * * *

C.k:

Absolutely no offense taken whatsoever in this corner of the campfire.  I just hope that you will eventually find your R9 to be as "comforting" as I do mine.

(1963-1967) "GO ARMY!"

Offline MountainMan

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #51 on: May 29, 2006, 07:57:46 PM »
Richard - I hope someday you get those sterling silver grips - if so I'm sure there are those who got the new G10 grips who would love to take the carbon fiber ones off your hands.

Capt.
I only wished that you would have contacted Tom Watson (theirishguard) here on the forum when you were looking for a R9 - the cost would not of been that much more than you paid for the refurb.  Tom is a dealer of high reputation that has also dealt with many police departments over the years.   Tom has sold many, many R9s and I have yet to hear of one that has had a problem if the owner used the recommended ammo.

Though if they told me the refurb was from a woman I can see how you would figure the gun should be ok.

Being in your business it is very understandable needing a reliable gun.  About loosing your LWS.380 to your wife - well she got a good deal.  I have several LWS.32s and a LWS.380 on order from Tom.  Truth is I carry the Seecamp and R9 about equal.  Nothing beats a Seecamp disappearing in your pocket wilth a RJ holster.

Once again Capt.  I hope the R9 works for you - it is one great gun -as is the Seecamp.  Maybe get rid of this R9 and put in a order through Tom for one of the new R9 Stealths that are suppose to be delivered in the Fall.

Once again Capt. - nice to have you on the forum - please join in on the conversation - this forum has many great people on it - it is more than just the gun.  I think a gun like the R9 brings a certain type of people together - people of honor.   The same for the Seecamp on the Seecamp forum.

Dave
« Last Edit: May 29, 2006, 08:16:06 PM by MountainMan »
"Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but the moments that take our breath away..."


Offline MountainMan

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #52 on: May 29, 2006, 08:01:24 PM »
Harry

Thanks for the break in info for the 1911.  I have to confess of being amazed that my new Kimber's owners manual says a 500 round full metal jacket hardball break in.  It will be awhile before I put ten boxes through it.  Then the spring will need changed at 800 rounds.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2006, 08:10:19 PM by MountainMan »
"Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but the moments that take our breath away..."


Offline tracker

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #53 on: May 29, 2006, 09:14:22 PM »
Kool,
Just curious, why would you want to qualify with
a firearm in which you have no confidence? I have
had two bad experiences in qualifying--both worked
out--with my favorite BHP, but next time I will probably
use a Glock or a well tested 1911, of which I have several,
or maybe one of my Sigs.  

Offline capt.koolaid

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #54 on: May 29, 2006, 09:42:27 PM »
I must confess, I noticed Tom is expecting a new R-9 in June and for a minute, I thought about jumping on it. Understand I'd gladly pay more for a R-9 that works because my lifes worth it.

But, alas, this R-9s made me "gun-shy" about em. Ive had problem guns before, (Kel-Tec comes to mind) but, through help from the Kel-Tec forums I was able to make it work with a few inexpensive "Mods". The Kel-Tec was never a highly sought after gun for me, (at the time I had to use a Kel-Tec for compatability with my duty weapon), but after I got the bugs worked out, I fell in love with it!

Had a lemon Glock once too. Got rid of it. would have been soured on Glocks too had I not owned two previously that were EXCELLENT!

Had a lemon Beretta evidently but the customer service was so poor I decided to NEVER AGAIN give them another shot. Once they found out I was a Police Officer they bent over backwards for me, then couldn't understand why I had a problem with that when I told them after seeing how they treated civillians I would no longer remain a customer.

In all honesty, I didnt buy the refurb R-9 to save money. I did it because Ive been lurking here a while LOOKING DESPERATLY for an R-9 and none has been available, new, used, or otherwise. I began to think if I didnt jump on the refurb I'd never find one. So...I took the plunge!

Then again, what would I do with my lemon R-9 if I bought a new one? would the new one not be a lemon? How would I sell my lemon R-9? list it as a lemon and hope for a charatable contributer to come along?  Then thiers the risk of whoever bought my Lemon R-9 being disatisfied and being a "problem customer" for me. I dont need that!

Im optimistic and still have a few avenues left. If Rohrbaugh replaces Guinness dogs problem "pup" with a brand-new one and offers to include the Carbon Fiber grips for his trouble then you can believe Ill ship mine out the next day! But realisticaly, I doubt that will happen. Maybe some dealer would allow me a trade-in of sorts. You know, a used R-9 trade in for a new one! Yea right!....Guess I need a reality check.

But I can dream!.....Greetings Capt! This is Eric. we examined your gun and found it to be signifigantly in error of machining tolerances! We apologize for the inconvienance however your patronage is valued to us. We were unable to correct the problem. Please accept this new R-9 stealth with carbon fiber grips as a suitable replacement! Rest assured it has been tested and found to be without fault! Have a nice day!

I know, far fetched. I contacted Rohrbaugh initialy BEFORE my purchase to secure a test model for our department like it says is available on thier website but the same female told me they quit doing that. ...wonder why?  ??? Anyway, Ive thought about contacting the brothers and asking If I could somehow swap em my R-9 for that OLD, BEAT UP, 1XX serial number series R-9s that they loaned out to gun magazine writers for testing. It seemed to work o.k.

Offline bigyimmy

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #55 on: May 29, 2006, 10:15:38 PM »
I love my problem free R9.  It is a very effective use of weight and size for a carry gun.

~Hold it like you mean it.

Offline Guinnessdog

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #56 on: May 29, 2006, 11:44:48 PM »
OK everybody, breathe into a paper bag for a bit, I sent the pup off and I promise to fill you in the moment I get back from the range once it returns! I'll give a full report including turnaround time, any correspondence, etc.

Watch this space for further developments...

Offline tracker

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #57 on: May 30, 2006, 12:21:25 AM »
Guinessdog and Kool,
When you say back off and breathe into a paper bag
keep in mind that we did not start this issue; we only
tried to give some perspective to the scale of your
individual problems compared to our overall experiences
with the R9S which is generally positive.

Granted, if you have a problem with an expensive
purchase, it is 100 % gone wrong but there is a
bigger picture here. Suffice it to say that we all
want every owner to be a satisfied one.

Offline theirishguard

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #58 on: May 30, 2006, 12:15:09 PM »
Kool, Just a thought here. Why not try the gun again, taking your time, bring a friend to watch and shoot and see what is going on at the range. If then, you don't get it worked out contact Rohrbaugh and give them a chance to fix the problem. On the carbon fiber grips thing, they don't have any more, so count that out. You will find the R bros also have an interest in solving this problem as well. They are fine people, so let them cure the problem.
Tom
Tom Watson, DVC , Quis Separabit ,  Who dares wins, Utrinque Paratus

Offline Guinnessdog

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Re: Second time with my new R9s - problems!
« Reply #59 on: May 30, 2006, 12:22:31 PM »
Guns and the issues surrounding them can be emotionally charged. I'm simply saying let's stay cool and wait to give the factory the opportunity to resolve the problem.

I will give a full, accurate and balanced report when it returns.