SEECAMP .380

[kjtrains]

Update:

My 380 is being returned to the seller.

It feeds Silvertips, but Hydra Shok do NOT chamber at all. Hydra Shok will not even hand feed and only make it about 3/4 of the way into the chamber. I notice there is a little dip in the chamber so I think that is causing the hang up. The seller has used not recommended truncated ammo and I am wondering if that may have caused the dip in the chamber. Maybe he even used high pressure rounds...  Either way the seller is being nice about it and is refunding my money. I will post this on the Seecamp forum too. It was fun while it lasted lol...   

CCW.  Sorry to hear of this problem, for sure.  Excellent that the seller is working with you and refunding your money.  Still, I know it's hard to take.  

LAA makes a good point.  Good luck in getting this resolved.

[FloridaCCW]

Florida CCW,

Sorry to hear about your problems.  I too had probs with the Hydrashoks feeding but only with the last round.  Mine is at Seecamp being looked at right now.  

Have you considered talking to Larry?  If you call the tech number on the Seecamp website, Larry actually answers the phone and is very personable and helpful.  When I talked to him, he said he doubted it was a problem with the ammo because Hydrashoks have such tight manufacturing tolerances.  However, now that I hear others are having the same problem, I wonder if it isn't an ammo manufacturing problem after all.  By now, Larry may have spoken with Federal and found out one way or the other whether it is an ammo problem.  Who knows, you may be able to save yourself the hassel of returning the gun and finding and winning the bid on another .380 by simply calling Larry.

If you got a good price on the .380, it may be worth it to send it in to Larry for a tune up rather than returning it to the Seller.   They really do stand behind every gun for the life of the gun and the warranty transfers with the gun.

Whatever you end up doing, I hope it all works out for you.

Thanks. The seller is actually having me send it to Larry because he wants it fixed too. It is NOT the ammo. The same Hydra ammo easily feeds into my other Seecamp 380 just fine. The chambers are simply different. Is the chamber damaged...I don't know. Is there variability in the manufacturing process of chambers when they are made? Could be...  We will see

[hedrok]

Tracker asked earlier "Why the passion.." (I'm paraphrasing)...and this is another example of the answer.  
Not only is the seller assisting in solving the problem CCW is having, but so will many others including the fine man whose name is on the pistol.
The same passion for the trade exists with Carl Rohrbaugh, as everyone here knows.
Sure gives some of us confidence that the old "American Spirit" is still alive.
Makes me proud to carry these guns.


Ya, I know...corny....but true.

[kjtrains]

hedrok.  Not corny at all.  I like that:  the old "American Spirit" is still alive; and  CCW.  Good that you are sending the .380 to Larry and seller wants it fixed as well.  

The passion continues and rightly so!  

[LAA]

Is there variability in the manufacturing process of chambers when they are made? Could be...  We will see

In short, the answer is yes, probably. . .

My understanding from talking to Larry is that with the exception of a few stamped parts (such as the hammer strut) all parts are cast large and hand milled to fit each unique gun. I'm not a metalurgist so I don't completely understand the reasoning behind this process but I believe it has something to do with maintaining maximum randomness in the molecular structure which creates a stronger matrix than if there are defined margins to the cast that require no finish work. Thus, by definition there are manufacturing variations in every hand milled Seecamp part and each Seecamp has a unique "personality".  In this regard, it is not uncommon for a Seecamp .32 to dislike a specific brand of ammo - this isn't too much of a problem because there are many varieties of ammo that work in the .32.  However, the same issue in a .380 is huge problem since there are only 2 types of ammo and Hydra Shoks seem to be the most readily available of the two.  As mentioned in my last e-mail, I'm sure Larry will make things right, even if it requires sending out an entirely new .380.

[ccoorreeyy]

There is quite a bit of hand  fitting in them but no hand milling anymore its done by a CNC machine.  Its an awfully cool process to watch it go frome two chunks to a polished gun.  I have pics from a factory visit I was blessed with a month ago that I can post of some of the how to's when I get home.  Larry did take me over to the old shop and show me the orginal machines that he got started with and that was real neat to see.

[kjtrains]

CCW.  I'm sure everything will be made right as well.  I just picked up the .380 and it looks very nice.  Won't have a chance to fire it until the Silvertips come in.  

[FloridaCCW]

Just spoke with Larry and he is stumped. He was very nice on the phone and aplogized for missing my call earlier in the day. He said this is a first and will figure things out.

[kjtrains]

CCW.  If Larry figures out the problem, do you keep it?  Just wondering.  My thought is, yes.  

[LAA]

There is quite a bit of hand  fitting in them but no hand milling anymore its done by a CNC machine.  Its an awfully cool process to watch it go frome two chunks to a polished gun.  I have pics from a factory visit I was blessed with a month ago that I can post of some of the how to's when I get home.  Larry did take me over to the old shop and show me the orginal machines that he got started with and that was real neat to see.

Thanks for the clarification.  I'm not a machinist either. As I was talking to Larry, I was trying to contrast in my mind the process that, for example, NAA uses (electronic injection molding) which results in precision pieces that have a lower tensil strength.  In my mind, I pictured the Seecamp milling process as a mechanical process involving human interaction, judgment and precision in operating the machinery rather than electronically designed and manufactured moldings and electronically controlled burnoff and injection.  Either way, I think you still end up with manufacturing variances with the Seecamps but the trade off in light weight durability and strength is worth it.  By contrast, the NAA Guardian .380, which is a fine precision manufactured gun for its price range, is significantly larger and dramatically heavier than the Seecamp .380 (even though it is a clone).  NAA says that by increasing the size of their .380, they can accommodate a larger range of ammol; this may be true, but it is also true that it was necessary to beef up the NAA .380, to compensate for lower tensil strength steel.

Ok, I'm just rambling now and perhaps I have hijacked the thread . . . Sorry.

[FloridaCCW]

CCW.  If Larry figures out the problem, do you keep it?  Just wondering.  My thought is, yes.  

If he can fix the issue then no problem exists. I would keep it then

[kjtrains]

Hope the fix is possible, and think it should be.  

[chameleon]

I tell ya what, I'd buy it after Larry finished with it.
No doubt that it will be fixed, and heavily tested. Not just by shooting, Larry will do as CCW did and test the fit of various ammunition.

[yankee2500]

Thanks for the clarification.  I'm not a machinist either. As I was talking to Larry, I was trying to contrast in my mind the process that, for example, NAA uses (electronic injection molding) which results in precision pieces that have a lower tensil strength.  In my mind, I pictured the Seecamp milling process as a mechanical process involving human interaction, judgment and precision in operating the machinery rather than electronically designed and manufactured moldings and electronically controlled burnoff and injection.  Either way, I think you still end up with manufacturing variances with the Seecamps but the trade off in light weight durability and strength is worth it.  By contrast, the NAA Guardian .380, which is a fine precision manufactured gun for its price range, is significantly larger and dramatically heavier than the Seecamp .380 (even though it is a clone).  NAA says that by increasing the size of their .380, they can accommodate a larger range of ammol; this may be true, but it is also true that it was necessary to beef up the NAA .380, to compensate for lower tensil strength steel.

Ok, I'm just rambling now and perhaps I have hijacked the thread . . . Sorry.

Any machining on a production pistol today is done with a CNC (computed numerically controlled) machine. There is a programmer who writes a program for the machine and once it is set up the human factor doe's very little. The operator watches the machine make the parts and looks for any problems, but has no real control of the actual machining.

John

[tracker]

I wonder where Larry buys his ammo.