Questions about Kel-Tec?

[Fud]

I tried sending Eric an e-mail but got an automated reply saying that e-mails are no longer being checked at this time and to contact them either by phone or letter.

Anybody know what's up with that?

[R9SCarry]

Not sure at all Alan.  When I last spoke with Eric tho (and I posted from that, a sorta update) - he did admit that he would personally be much less available on the phone - simply because he needs way more time ''on the job''.

Maria is fielding most calls now but I think Karl will also take calls when needed.

Another factor right now - altho it seems they have their internet connection in place, after a long lapse, it is worth remembering that Eric is away - he was taking off most of this month due to basically having dug himself a huge hole - thru overwork.  Burn-out might be a good description!

He is in touch with office but was going to be there at Houston this last weekend ... an award was to be presented for the R9.  He also hopes to make other calls on his way round what is quite a fair bit of travel.

So - making assumptions here but - would not be surprised if it is very much a manpower thing - or lack of it - plus the ever present attempt to get guns out the door.

[DDGator]

E-mail to the factory is turned off for now.  It was getting too burdensome for them.  For the forseeable future, its best to try and reach them by phone.  Maria will field most of the calls that are not technical in nature.

Its a fact of life -- these guys are growing and having to do business a little differently--i.e., more like the way everyone else does.  

E-mail may come back or may not.  We will have to wait and see.

[Wayne]

E-mail to the factory is turned off for now.  It was getting too burdensome for them.  For the forseeable future, its best to try and reach them by phone.  Maria will field most of the calls that are not technical in nature.

Its a fact of life -- these guys are growing and having to do business a little differently--i.e., more like the way everyone else does.  

E-mail may come back or may not.  We will have to wait and see.

IMHO, email is a major customer service tool.  Turning it off is like disconnecting your phone service and just answering delivered mail.  It doesn't stem demand for consumer information, it just makes the information more difficult to access.

I know these guys are extremely busy, and I can appreciate the wonderful support that I was given, but as they are now realizing, the more their business grows, the more they will be forced to focus on more strategic tasks, rather than customer service.  It's just a fact of life for a successful company.  Other companies deal with that by hiring customer service people, or other people they can delegate to.

Are they in a position to hire some help?

[R9SCarry]

Wayne - I think they may well need to take on another person or two - before too long but - I would emphasize that right now - it is IMO Eric's necessary absence that probably produces the current status quo.

Once he is back - early May I'd think, then perhaps the email thing will re-open.  I take your point, it is important in the long term.

[DDGator]

Wayne,

Maria will focus on the customer service angle -- you just won't have one of the main guys answering the phone all day long.  It doesn't make sense.

The problem with e-mail is that it accumulates all day and all night long.  People will e-mail all sorts of questions that they may not feel comfortable calling about.  And, it opens up back and forth discussions.  

The info customers need is still availble -- its just by phone during business hours.  Honestly, its probably quicker and faster service anyway.

I don't know how many gun companies really respond to e-mail requests...  

I guess we will see how it goes.  I don't know what the future holds for that aspect of the business, but I don't think its critical.  These guys need to sell a lot of guns to recoup the huge initial investement.  Most of the "employees" of Rohrbaugh work for free, even now.  

[TW]

>>I'm going to be a bit more blunt than Chris and Duane regarding this business about Eric being away, and the bigger picture of customer service at Rohrbaugh Firearms as it now stands...

A month or so ago it was abusive e-mail and phone calls which pushed Eric over the edge to the point of needing a break, and for the company to begin re-evaluations on how to optimize employee efforts as a branch of that.

Those of us who have dealt directly with the company know how much of a "giver" Eric is.  I suspect the guy was BORN that way, and add to that a proper upbringing with strong morals and values, and you have the class act of a fellow that he is today.  Eric is also a sensitive guy, which reveals itself to us in how personally he gives of himself...and how he takes things in...!!  Then there is Karl who is the sensable one in the family/company, and who seems to hold the big picture for where the company is going...and to see what is happening to the pieces as they effect the whole.  Did I mention that Karl is a no nonsense guy...?...!

Sooooo...some weeks ago now we have Eric with certain people taking advantage of his kindness and desire to help...and finally he's had enough.  Big Brother Karl sees what is happening and makes some hard and fast decisions...  

To Eric he says to take a break/get away from it/go chill out...and if you feel like coming into work - go in the back and build some guns...!!  We on the other hand are told Rohrbaugh e-mail is to be shut down for the time being...it's use to be re-evaluated at a later date.  Because Rohrbaugh Firearms STILL stands for not only quality products, but customer service second to none - Karl points towards Maria as the knowledgeable customer servant to help us out...which is probably the way it should have been from the beginning...and which Karl, Eric, and crew will get together and determine at a later date along with how to best optimize Eric's energies at work.  Sadly, just as Maria is settling in as the #1 customer servant - some OTHER Bozos in the industry start harassing HER on the job.  But that gets me on a tangent I don't want to go to at the moment...

I've said this before and I will say it again now only a bit louder... RIGHT NOW WE ALL NEED TO GIVE THE FOLKS AT ROHRBAUGH FIREARMS SOME BREATHING ROOM, TIME TO RECOUP, AND REORGANIZE.  Once Eric gets back in the saddle, reshuffling happens, and the company is able to catch up on their orders...maybe then we will see how customer service will evolve.  If that means Eric is doing something else, then that's the way it has to be.  If that means Eric is back building guns - I hope I get one of the ones he builds...!...because no one will build them better...!!  Then, if more staff are needed for customer service, I'm confident they will be hired eventually/at the earliest opportunity.

I should think all of us here should be able to accept what all is happening with Rohrbaugh, even if it saddens us not to be dealing directly with Eric in the future.  It would be nice to catch and hold accountable the SOBs who have helped bring this down on us all...but that's not likely to happen...is life in the world as it is today...same amount of space with more people in it = fruitcakes and inconsiderates standing out.  Only constructive thing I can say here is don't give your business to people who come off that way.  There are plenty of good people out there who deserve our support...like those at Rohrbaugh Firearms...!...TW<<

[R9SCarry]

Thanks for that TW - I know you have some good info there and we must be cognisant of the many factors involved.

I for one quite simply wish all that is good for that whole team, and certainly hope very much that Eric's time away has been, in part at least - cathartic and healing.

What you mention about Eric is so, so true,  Back in UK, were I there still (sigh of relief I ain't!) - he would by me and many be referred to as the ''archetypal gentleman'' ... I knew and sensed this first time I ever met him.  He is ''up there'' in so many ways and I have felt privelaged to have known him.  They broke the mould after he appeared!

I think we have to see the ''now'' as a new phase in the Company's growth and development.  Those like me - sorta, in on the ground floor - have to accept the need for change and expansion, with inevitably not quite so much available of the old style.

I know little about the ''SOB intrusions'' but that sorta situation angers me at best of times.  the more so when such good hard-working folks are on the receiving end.

Thx again TW - all should read your words.

[Fud]

Okay, now I'm totally confused  

• ... abusive e-mail and phone calls which pushed Eric over the edge to the point of needing a break ...
  
  
• ... we have Eric with certain people taking advantage of his kindness and desire to help...and finally he's had enough ...
  
  
• ... just as Maria is settling in as the #1 customer servant - some OTHER Bozos in the industry start harassing HER on the job ...
  
  
• ... It would be nice to catch and hold accountable the SOBs who have helped bring this down on us all...but that's not likely to happen...is life in the world as it is today...same amount of space with more people in it = fruitcakes and inconsiderates standing out.  Only constructive thing I can say here is don't give your business to people who come off that way.  There are plenty of good people out there who deserve our support...like those at Rohrbaugh Firearms ...

You said a lot of things which I didn't fully understand. If it isn't appropriate to be said publicly, can you please PM me and let me know what's going on over there?



... RIGHT NOW WE ALL NEED TO GIVE THE FOLKS AT ROHRBAUGH FIREARMS SOME BREATHING ROOM ...

I just wanted to chat with Eric a little bit AND place an order for a second R9S ... in the past, we did this via e-mail instead of telephone.

[TW]

>>Hi Fudster...

No worries, my friend.  In no way was I speaking about you any more than I was about myself and our collective...!  In other words...I was talking about all of us - not any ONE of us...see...?...lol...!  If that doesn't confuse you then nothing will...but then you were already confused, huh.

I know exactly what you mean about wanting to chat with Eric as well as give him new business.  That's the way it was when I first became interested in the Rohrbaugh R9 and for the longest while this was business as usual.  My point is that "business as usual" is in the process of changing, and unfortunately we may no longer have the privilege/luxury of chatting with Eric whether by e-mail or phone as we had become accustom to doing.  

I'm not saying Eric will be totally out of the loop and won't talk to people...after all Eric is a people person and would probably go NUTS if he couldn't talk with folks about things of mutual interest.  It's just that things are likely to be different, and Maria will be filling the customer service role more and more - which was probably her intended job from the start...!  I suspect Eric, who is after all Vice President of the company, will be doing more things fitting to his position...which probably did not include being the point guy for us, the end users, to be conversing with on a daily basis.  Come to think of it - we aren't even technically Rohrbaugh customers...not directly, anyway.  Rohrbaugh is not a retail business.  Their clients are the gun shops and we are their customers. Oh, what a tangled web we weave...

Regarding the individuals I mentioned who are responsible for taking advantage of Eric and harassing Maria...  I see no value in bringing up names on a public forum, nor do I know all these people and I don't need to.  However, I do see value in mentioning what has happened and why, as well as the effects it has on the Rohrbaugh team and us the end user.  Reason being more and more people who are accustomed to communicating with Eric are finding him unavailable and they don't understand why.  

Until Eric gets back to work and settled in we will not know for sure exactly what changes may be in store regarding the way Rohrbaugh Firearms handles customer service over the long haul.  Perhaps things will go back to the way they were...  Probably not, but maybe.  Meanwhile Rohrbaugh Firearms still RULE, and answers to our questions will be available...just by different means.  

Fudster, if you wish to take this further through a PM - fine by me.  Though I think the best way would be for you to ask me specific questions about things which confuse you.  Your call.  BTW, the idea of getting a second R9 is a good one.  I picked up my #2 a few weeks ago and I have to say it was just as exciting as when #1 arrived...!!...probably more so, given the circumstances.  But that is a story for another day...TW<<  

[theirishguard]

Patience is a virtue!!!! I know sometimes it is hard to remember that, but; we all need to work on it at times. Rohrbaugh is still the king of customer service compared to all the other gun manufactures out there. It is very rare that any gun manufacture would spend as much time and effort on customer service as Rohrbaugh. We need to be more like Karl and look at the big picture-more guns and catch up on the back log. The higher volume will heal alot. Maybe work thru your dealer and ask them to find answers to your questions. This will limit the calls & contacts,which will ease up the situation for Rohrbaugh. Just a thought.  Tom

[TW]

Maybe work thru your dealer and ask them to find answers to your questions. This will limit the calls & contacts,which will ease up the situation for Rohrbaugh. Just a thought.  Tom

>>To play my own devil's advocate...  Given the average dealer, and some of the more technical questions we see here on the forums - I'm not sure Mr. average dealer would necessarily be able to communicate some of the info people want.  However...  Lets not forget there is the Rohrbaugh Forum as a resource, with it's vast wealth of information, and knowledgeable contributors on hand to help out.  Quite frankly, I would probably start my questions here before going to the folks at Rohrbaugh Firearms.  Another thought...TW<<

[theirishguard]

I think the forum is the place to go right now for tech info and range test reports. But we might let the Rohrbaugh dealers call Maria and ask customer service questions, after all they are Rohrbaugh's customers, plus it would limit the number of calls. The mark of a good dealer is also based on customer service. Let the dealer field the questions on when their orders will ship and then give that information to their customers. By easing up on the number of calls and contacts to Rohrbaugh, they can get on with the business of making guns and filling orders. This might make the whole Rohrbaugh family more happy,which includes all of us.   Tom

[TW]

I think the forum is the place to go right now for tech info and range test reports. But we might let the Rohrbaugh dealers call Maria and ask customer service questions, after all they are Rohrbaugh's customers, plus it would limit the number of calls. The mark of a good dealer is also based on customer service. Let the dealer field the questions on when their orders will ship and then give that information to their customers. By easing up on the number of calls and contacts to Rohrbaugh, they can get on with the business of making guns and filling orders. This might make the whole Rohrbaugh family more happy,which includes all of us.   Tom

>>Oh Tom - you're just saying all that stuff because you happen to be one of the more knowledgeable gun dealers when it comes to Rohrbaugh, and you want people to buy R9s from you...!  LOL...!!  Heck yeah...!  And it's good to know you are around and available too...!  Wish I had known of you when I bought my first R9 (and I haven't forgotten about that Seecamp either...would prefer to buy from you for the same reasons as a Rohrbaugh).

You make a good case for folks to bring their questions to their dealers rather than direct to Rohrbaugh...although the number of calls to Maria would be the same regardless of who calls...but they would probably be shorter if coming from the dealers.

One thing we really haven't addressed is the fact some folks become interested in owning an R9 after seeing/hearing others discuss their experiences chatting with the guys at the factory.  Call it the "Rock Star" factor.  People come to like the idea that they too CAN (or could) talk to one of the co-creators personally...he who we have come to call "our very own Eric".  This is where it get's hard to reason.  Because it's looking like he may not be "our" Eric much longer.  I know Eric is aware of all this, and it's not something he takes lightly...if for no other reason than he does enjoy talking with the end users about his products...!  But he also knows the business end of it - and how good PR generates MORE business.  In my own experience I have found that a good reputation pays off word of mouth as much or better than official advertising!

Again...at the moment we just don't know what the future will bring concerning this stuff, but we need to be prepared for the fact things will be different...whatever that means...!...TW<<

[theirishguard]

TW, Yes, it would be nice if more folks bought R9s from me;however, the dealer should be more than an interface between the factory and the end user. The duty of a good dealer should be to provide customer service to their customers as well as make a profit and stay in business. Now most dealers order several guns at a time. So when they check on their orders, it is usually for a multiple gun order. This in it self limits the number of calls. We all need to ease up on Rohrbaugh and let them get about the business of shipping guns. The Seecamp folks are moving into a larger building this summer and should be able to build more guns by this fall. I've got my fingers crossed. I'm waiting on an order to ship in June. TW, I am happy you got a SP101 in 9mm!  Regards,  Tom