The Rohrbaugh Forum

Miscellaneous => The Water Cooler -- General Discussions => Topic started by: tracker on July 09, 2010, 10:28:28 PM

Title: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 09, 2010, 10:28:28 PM
Some may not realize it but Jack Hays put Colt back in business with the Walker Colt and quite possibly is responsible for bringing the pistol to its status as a combat weapon. He never lost a battle, over 100, against Indians and Mexicans, and it was usually against overwhelming odds.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Coffee_Hays
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 10, 2010, 09:24:51 AM
Definitely did not know that.  Great history.  Thanks!
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 10, 2010, 10:14:12 AM
"Tracker" is absolutely right about Colonel Hays. By way of further example, the following is an excerpt from page 2 of the book, Lone Star Lawmen -- The Second Century of the Texas Rangers, by Robert M. Utley:

[size=10]The model for all subsequent [Ranger] captains, John Coffee Hays pioneered mounted combat by adopting the first revolving pistol, the five-shot Paterson Colt. At the Battle of Walker Creek in 1844, he and fourteen Rangers took on seventy Comanche warriors and employed the revolver so effectively that only twenty Indians escaped the battlefield unhurt.[/size]

[size=10]Edit: Typo.[/size]

Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 10, 2010, 12:38:10 PM
Quote
Some may not realize it but Jack Hays put Colt back in business with the Walker Colt and quite possibly is responsible for bringing the pistol to its status as a combat weapon. He never lost a battle, over 100, against Indians and Mexicans, and it was usually against overwhelming odds.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Coffee_Hays

tracker's and Richard's posts sparked some more interest and this is just to add to their comments:

http://collections.museumca.org/item_detail.jsp?id=138742
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: yankee2500 on July 10, 2010, 01:05:33 PM
What a team these two would have made.
Colonel John Coffee "Jack" Hays     &      Cordell Walker
(http://i413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/yankee2500/0412602b.jpg)  (http://i413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/yankee2500/Walkers_92.jpg)

John
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 10, 2010, 01:20:08 PM

One interesting side note, to me at least, is that Jack Hays was born and raised in East Cedar Lick, Tn. in Wilson County. Wilson County was named after one of my patriot ancestors, Major David Wilson, who fought at the battle of King's Mountain for the N.C. militia and defeated the British there in a turning point in the Revolutionary War one year before Yorktown.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 10, 2010, 01:40:50 PM
I go through King's Mountain, NC, going to GA. and have relatives that live in Yorktown now; lived close to there (Yorktown) as a kid; interesting.    
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 10, 2010, 01:54:33 PM

King's Mountain N.C. was renamed that because it was the town closest to the Battle of King's Mountain just across the line in S.C.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 10, 2010, 03:54:19 PM
Quote
One interesting side note, to me at least, is that Jack Hays was born and raised in East Cedar Lick, Tn. in Wilson County. Wilson County was named after one of my patriot ancestors, Major David Wilson, who fought at the battle of King's Mountain for the N.C. militia and defeated the British there in a turning point in the Revolutionary War one year before Yorktown.

Tracker:

Wilson County's website acknowledges that it is named in honor of your patriot ancestor:

http://www.wilsoncountytn.com/

And the Battle of Kings Mountain is the subject of a ballad originally recorded by "Grandpa Jones" of early country music fame:

"Sweet Lips: The Battle of King's Mountain"

It was back in '81 that a man named Washington
Was fighting hard for freedom in this land,
But his men were poor and ragged,
And against the British gun,
Well, he didn't even dare to make a stand.

Old Ferguson was marching toward the Carolina hills,
Making brags he'd hang a man to every tree,
But the news that he was coming
Raced across the mountain tops,
And they heard about it over in Tennessee.

At the shoal of old Watauga, where the sycamores grow tall,
They rallied around ol' Nolichucky Jack,
And they said, "We'll drive the Redcoats
Back across the briny deep.
Yes, we'll lick 'em, or we're never coming back!"

There was Chucky Jack and Campbell, Colonel Shelby in their band,
Mountaineers who loved their liberty,
And a lovesick boy named Gillam
With a brand new rifle gun,
Named for his girl in Tennessee.

Sweet Lips was a rifle named for a girl in Tennessee.
When Sweet Lips spoke,
The chains that bound us broke.
She struck a mighty blow for liberty.

When they rode across the mountains onto Carolina soil,
The Tarheels with their muskets gathered 'round
To go and head off Ferguson
Before he got to them
To hang 'em all and burn their houses down.

When Ferguson heard the mountain men were camping on his trail,
He first began to laugh and then to scoff,
Said, "We'll go up on King's Mountain,
And then let the rebels come,
For the powers of Hell will never drive me off."

But Campbell and Ben Cleveland, Colonel Shelby, and their men,
And John Sevier ~ ol' Nolichucky Jack ~
Well, they loaded up their rifles,
And they climbed the mountainside,
Said, "We'll lick 'em, or we're never coming back!"

Oh, he blew his silver whistle, and he shouted and he cursed,
"Use your bayonets to drive the rebels back!"
But the Redcoats never made it,
For before they reached the line,
The mountain rifles jumped them in their tracks.

Sweet Lips was a rifle named for a girl in Tennessee.
When Sweet Lips spoke,
The chains that bound us broke.
She struck a mighty blow for liberty.

Ol' Ferguson was dashing up and down the battlefield,
And it seemed that he must lead a life of charm,
For the mountaineers were aiming
At his gaudy checkered coat,
But their bullets passed him by and did no harm.

Then up stepped young John Gillam with his brand new rifle gun,
Named for his girl back home. He said,
"Well, I wonder what Sweet Lips can do?"
And when he took his aim,
Sweet Lips spoke, and Ferguson fell dead.

Cornwallis heard that Ferguson and all his men were lost,
And he said, "This place is just too hot for me."
So he soon went off to Yorktown,
Where he laid his weapons down,
And ever since this country has been free.

Sweet Lips was a rifle named for a girl in Tennessee.
When Sweet Lips spoke,
The chains that bound us broke.
She's gone and did her part for liberty.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 10, 2010, 04:05:30 PM

Thanks for that, Richard; there is a lot of history and some heavy weight Tennessee Mountain Men named in the song. Those sharpshooters were no doubt responsible for the victory at King's Mountain.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 10, 2010, 04:42:45 PM
That ballad does have one historical error, I believe. The Battle of Kings Mountain was not fought in 1781 but on October 7, 1780.

Ferguson was quoted as saying, that he "was on Kings Mountain, that he was king of that mountain and that God Almighty and all the Rebels of hell could not drive him from it." That was definitely the wrong taunt to throw at the Tennessee Mountain Men. But Ferguson was correct in one respect -- he is still on that mountain, "a-moulderin' in the grave."

http://www.theamericanrevolution.org/battledetail.aspx?battle=25

Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 10, 2010, 05:32:23 PM
More great history, and so close to home.  Thanks.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Reinz on July 10, 2010, 07:58:12 PM
I'm not anywhere close to you guys (TX) and I found that info interesteing, especially for Tracker.

Reinz
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 10, 2010, 08:05:51 PM

The history of Tennessee and Texas fits like a hand in a glove. The two state universities even have the same colors. Thanks, Reinz; I am very proud of the legacy.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Reinz on July 10, 2010, 08:44:18 PM
You  are right, there were some TN boys at the Alamo.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 11, 2010, 09:59:55 AM
Quote
You  are right, there were some TN boys at the Alamo.

These 32, I believe:

Micajah Autry
Joseph Bayliss
John Blair
Samuel C. Blair
Robert Campbell
George Washington Cottle
David Crockett
Squire Daymon
William Dearduff
Almeron Dickerson
John H. Dillard
James L. Ewing
William Garnett
James Girard Garrett
John Camp Goodrich
Charles M. Haskell
William Marshall
Jesse McCoy
Thomas R. Miller
William Mills
Andrew M. Nelson
James Robertson
Andrew H. Smith
A. Spain Summerlin
William E. Summers
Edward Taylor
George Taylor
James Taylor
William Taylor
Asa Walker
Jacob Walker
Joseph G. Washington

Texas and Tennessee do indeed have a special bond between them in history and culture.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 11, 2010, 04:51:13 PM

Watching this DVD about the Texas Rangers, Jack Hays, Leander McNelly, et. al., is what piqued my interest in this extraordinary chapter of Texas and American history.



http://www.legendsofamerica.com/Video/texasrangers.html  
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 11, 2010, 05:26:09 PM
Very interesting stuff, there, tracker, for sure!  Thanks!  I found a favorite place to visit in NC on this site.  Just click on a your state on tracker's post and find your interest.

http://www.biltmore.com/landing/10_summer_visits.asp


Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 11, 2010, 06:16:30 PM

Thanks, KJ; I missed that feature the first time around. The Biltmore is indeed one of America's treasures. This editorial appeared in the N.Y. Times today. I would love to hear Captain Hays's remarks after reading this one.



http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/11/opinion/11sun1.html?_r=1&ref=todayspaper
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 11, 2010, 07:05:41 PM
May a merciful God save us from the "Nannys" among us.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 11, 2010, 07:42:00 PM
Silly me; I thought it was the Constitution that was "obdurate", not our lawmakers and lobbyists.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Aglifter on July 14, 2010, 03:37:55 AM
Quote
The history of Tennessee and Texas fits like a hand in a glove. The two state universities even have the same colors. Thanks, Reinz; I am very proud of the legacy.

That school in Austin really shouldn't be mentioned in polite company... ;D
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 14, 2010, 10:54:08 AM
Quote

That school in Austin really shouldn't be mentioned in polite company... ;D

One of my former partners was from a certain school in College Station. He maintained that after about ten years following graduation a good percentage of the alumni of the school in Austin would use the term "Boss" when addressing alumni of the school in College Station. I, of course, have no knowledge of the validity of such an assertion.  ;D
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 14, 2010, 11:06:43 AM

As a fearless warrior, Captain Jack Hays does sound more like Aggie material to me.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: P7Enigma on July 14, 2010, 11:26:20 AM
Quote
"Tracker" is absolutely right about Colonel Hays. By way of further example, the following is an excerpt from page 2 of the book, Lone Star Lawmen -- The Second Century of the Texas Rangers, by Robert M. Utley:

[size=10]The model for all subsequent [Ranger] captains, John Coffee Hays pioneered mounted combat by adopting the first revolving pistol, the five-shot Paterson Colt. At the Battle of Walker Creek in 1844, he and fourteen Rangers took on seventy Comanche warriors and employed the revolver so effectively that only twenty Indians escaped the battlefield unhurt.[/size]

[size=10]Edit: Typo.[/size]


I knew that book would come in handy one day! ;)
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 14, 2010, 11:32:54 AM
Hullabaloo, Caneck!  Caneck!    ;D
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 14, 2010, 11:48:37 AM
Quote

I knew that book would come in handy one day! ;)

That was a test to see if you were alert and on duty. ;)  (Enigma sold me the book as a fundraiser for the "Cult of the P7" forum.)   8)
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 14, 2010, 11:55:47 AM
That was certainly good of you, P7, to do that.  You're a great contributor!    ;D  Even though you did sell it!   :D
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 14, 2010, 12:01:06 PM
KJ:

Comparing our post counts, it would appear that I am about to pass the baton.  ;D
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: tracker on July 14, 2010, 12:02:19 PM

I think that was the goal.
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 14, 2010, 12:08:42 PM
Quote
KJ:

Comparing our post counts, it would appear that I am about to pass the baton.  ;D

Richard.  All in fun!    ;D
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: P7Enigma on July 14, 2010, 12:11:44 PM
Quote
That was certainly good of you, P7, to do that.  You're a great contributor!    ;D  Even though you did sell it!   :D

Sent book and Richard took it to Critter Creek that weekend I think....a huumble "request that he make a donation"...don't remember what that was....

"hooah"
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: Richard S on July 14, 2010, 12:46:46 PM
Quote

Richard.  All in fun!    ;D

Go, Team!    8)
Title: Re: Colonel Jack Hays Texas Ranger
Post by: kjtrains on July 14, 2010, 12:49:33 PM
Right!  All part of the FUN TEAM!     ;D